|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 20, 2024 21:13:34 GMT -6
To be fair, women’s sports are a little different than men’s sports. From my unscientific observations the women are much more loyal to their team and don’t tend to hop around every year. That’s a big part of the reason why they are doing better. I give the 3 programs you mentioned huge props for their success but it’s not exactly comparable to men’s basketball in particular where everyone that averages 10 points a game hits the portal wanting to go to a big team and get paid big money. The female athletes just don’t do that crap usually…and thankfully.
|
|
|
Post by shorthaircut on Jan 20, 2024 21:17:41 GMT -6
You are using Duke as a comparison? This coaching staff has not recruited well….period. They were not as good as prior staff in D2….period. We have kicked off at LEAST 8 players since this staff took over. This is why I am concerned. Reread the Duke part. It's not a comparison lol. I agree though, you never want to see players kicked off the team. Tillmon being removed this year was unfortunate but I'm not blaming Stan for that. That's on Jordan. I'd encourage you to ask around legitimate sources in the program to find out what happened there. Sometimes guys who bounce from program to program continue to do that. I understand your frustrations with the program for sure but maybe my expectations just aren't as high... yet. Who recruited Tillmon to USI? We actually recruited him out of JUCO and Florida A&M. I just hope the administration holds people accountable. That’s all I am asking.
|
|
|
Post by eaglepride on Jan 20, 2024 21:40:15 GMT -6
The women's basketball team would disagree with you, the women's soccer team would disagree with you, the volleyball team would disagree with you about year two of the transition I only follow men's basketball and that is what I know it to be true for. I can't speak on other programs/sports. It's also comparing apples to oranges imo. I'm happy for the women succeeding so quickly but I don't expect the same immediate results for men's basketball. They are totally different landscapes. Perhaps you are right about the apples and oranges comparison. The point I was trying to make was that those sports have the same hands tied with transition and they are winning games. And I believe they are winning games because there is no drama on the team. Think about this Mandi Webb left SIUE to play for USI her Senior year at USI knowing that USI can't even make it to the NCAA tournament. And why did Mani want to come there to play? Because there is no drama on the women's basketball team. And the women are winning games. What bothers me about Stan it seems every year there is drama on his teams. I really believe if there was not drama on this years team the men would be 9-11 or 10-10 right know. I believe if there was no drama on last years team we would have won at least 20 games last year. I believe if there was no drama on the 2021-22 team the team would have been better that 18-8 and would have made the NCAA D2 tournament. If there keeps being drama on USI teams nobody would want to play for us even when we are out of the transition.
|
|
|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 20, 2024 21:58:46 GMT -6
Agree the drama is an issue. Hope that changes soon.
|
|
|
Post by shorthaircut on Jan 20, 2024 22:05:02 GMT -6
Agree the drama is an issue. Hope that changes soon. To change then one of two things has to happen. Either the coach has to lighten up or you have to recruit players that don’t cause drama. But here is the issue with the latter. How many of the players has Stan personally recruited has he he kicked off or suspended? I can think of 7 off the top of my head. That is just not normal at ANY school. So the logical question is why is that happening? This staff wanted Tillmon out of Connors State AND Florida A&M. Did Tillmon overnight become an issue or is the staff evaluation missing things? Stan says all the right things and has said many times how they really spend time evaluating character. So why do we seem to have more issues than literally every team in the country?
|
|
|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 20, 2024 22:20:25 GMT -6
Agree the drama is an issue. Hope that changes soon. To change then one of two things has to happen. Either the coach has to lighten up or you have to recruit players that don’t cause drama. But here is the issue with the latter. How many of the players has Stan personally recruited has he he kicked off or suspended? I can think of 7 off the top of my head. That is just not normal at ANY school. So the logical question is why is that happening? This staff wanted Tillmon out of Connors State AND Florida A&M. Did Tillmon overnight become an issue or is the staff evaluation missing things? Stan says all the right things and has said many times how they really spend time evaluating character. So why do we seem to have more issues than literally every team in the country? I agree Stan is a little heavy handed on some of his discipline and he needs to take a hard look at why he is doing that to players he recruited. Timon is a mystery to me, but we sorely miss his game. Also agree we seem to have much more drama than most teams with discipline issues and I don’t have the answer to that. I think he has at least changed one thing that has made us better though…playing the better players more minutes and sitting Mervis more. Campion is not perfect, but my god he busts his tail and at 120 mph while on the floor. He gets in his man’s face and makes his life hell…gotta love his fire. I think Stan realizes ghe better not tick off another guard this year and it’s nice to see Hernandez and Campion getting well over 30 minutes. Had he done that with Tilmon we would be a better team now.
|
|
|
Post by aujarhead on Jan 21, 2024 21:46:44 GMT -6
For those saying that women’s teams don’t get hit by the portal, my two cents…
It’s going to happen sooner or later to USI. Coaches know this, and know that they can’t prevent it. Last year, over 1200 women entered the transfer portal. I wouldn’t be shocked if we lose 2 or 3 this year, would also not be shocked if everyone comes back, too.
As to why we are competitive…. I think Stein recruited at a high level for d2, which is also competitive with low level D1. Bringing in Webb and Saunders have been huge, and then several teams in the OVC got hit by girls going into the portal.
Little Rock (won regular season ovc) lost 5. UT Martin lost 3 TTU lost 4 (won ovc tournament) Tenn State lost 7
So I think “keeping the team” together has had a lot to do with this (assuming a “plug and play” with Webb/Gannon for Haithcock/Brown/Robbe). Imagine how we’d be if Ariel showed up!
|
|
|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 21, 2024 22:17:59 GMT -6
Appreciate your perspective on the portal. I didn’t realize those OVC teams were hit that hard by the portal but it explains why a few you mentioned seem to be a notch down this year. I’m sure one day it will hit USI as well but at this point is hasn’t really negatively affected us yet. If anything it helped us with Webb and Saunders which are both very impressive. By my own admission I follow the men’s basketball portal closely but not so much on the ladies side. I’m sure we have a few that are good enough to bump up to a higher mid or low P5, but if they are happy her and are getting good minutes I am hoping they stay. If we lose anyone to the portal after this season I would hope it would be a few that don’t get much playing time that are upper classmen. I could see the dropping to D2 so they could play more, and that would be understandable. I still feel in my gut that the ladies are more loyal in general though compared to the men’s side. I think many men’s fans here are just concerned with the drama and revolving door on the men’s side because we lose several every year…and it started even before the portal was so popular. I would personally like to see that decrease as time goes on so we can build some stability.
|
|
|
Post by sandtiger on Jan 22, 2024 2:36:12 GMT -6
I've said it before and it bears repeating I'm tired of teams that I am rooting for shooting themselves in the foot in the name of 'Character and integrity' punish them in private. Deal with the players internally in the off season but don't put a lesser product out there mid-season in order to make a point. The Colts did it this season when they suspended 2 players 3 games before the end of the season, punished the rest of the team and the fans by not making the playoffs. Stan did it to KP in the Edwardsville game and you can't tell me that we didn't need him that game.
|
|
|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 22, 2024 8:58:43 GMT -6
I've said it before and it bears repeating I'm tired of teams that I am rooting for shooting themselves in the foot in the name of 'Character and integrity' punish them in private. Deal with the players internally in the off season but don't put a lesser product out there mid-season in order to make a point. The Colts did it this season when they suspended 2 players 3 games before the end of the season, punished the rest of the team and the fans by not making the playoffs. Stan did it to KP in the Edwardsville game and you can't tell me that we didn't need him that game. I agree and have said pretty much the same thing. Keeping KP and others from playing games hurts the team and the fans for not seeing our best guys when we paid to see the “entire “ team. Punishment should be private and outside of games imo. I’m not saying let them get away with anything, just don’t punish everyone else in the process.
|
|
|
Post by shorthaircut on Jan 22, 2024 9:29:21 GMT -6
I've said it before and it bears repeating I'm tired of teams that I am rooting for shooting themselves in the foot in the name of 'Character and integrity' punish them in private. Deal with the players internally in the off season but don't put a lesser product out there mid-season in order to make a point. The Colts did it this season when they suspended 2 players 3 games before the end of the season, punished the rest of the team and the fans by not making the playoffs. Stan did it to KP in the Edwardsville game and you can't tell me that we didn't need him that game. I agree and have said pretty much the same thing. Keeping KP and others from playing games hurts the team and the fans for not seeing our best guys when we paid to see the “entire “ team. Punishment should be private and outside of games imo. I’m not saying let them get away with anything, just don’t punish everyone else in the process. One thing I guarantee we all agree on, this coming offseason will be the most important one in a long, long time. We have to stop the bleeding because what you don’t want coming out of the transition period is recruiting from a position of weakness. Bruce Pearl has said and even said recently, the better D2 programs are better than low DI basketball. In this league we should be more competitive in mens basketball now than we are now.
|
|
|
Post by eagle87 on Jan 22, 2024 9:38:20 GMT -6
Agree this is going to be one of the most important recruiting years ever. We can’t have another year of basically total misses. At minimum, 2 immediate impact players are needed, hopefully more than that. After seeing Minix play I’m not so sure we shouldn’t start looking at NAIA stars and trying to get them to jump to D1. Same goes for D2 stars. What has not worked out well for us is taking P5 guys that never played…Hason,Nwoke last year,and even KP,although he is getting better. We need proven players with experience. Hopefully we can add about 5-7 new guys that fit my description.
|
|
|
Post by shorthaircut on Jan 22, 2024 9:45:08 GMT -6
Agree this is going to be one of the most important recruiting years ever. We can’t have another year of basically total misses. At minimum, 2 immediate impact players are needed, hopefully more than that. After seeing Minix play I’m not so sure we shouldn’t start looking at NAIA stars and trying to get them to jump to D1. Same goes for D2 stars. What has not worked out well for us is taking P5 guys that never played…Hason,Nwoke last year,and even KP,although he is getting better. We need proven players with experience. Hopefully we can add about 5-7 new guys that fit my description. Western Illinois took the big man from UMSL, who was solid but not spectacular. Now he’s a major force for them, far better than Causwell. Minix the kid UE got, for the time being I would much rather have guys proven on the court, regardless of level, vs guys who sat the bench at their prior institution.
|
|
|
Post by sandtiger on Jan 22, 2024 9:50:27 GMT -6
I just thought about this, it's a little bit ironic that our coaches preach accountability and being there when your teammates need you right? How many times a night do they run that Old National Bank wealth management ad? The one where the 3 people are like "There is so much I want to ask him but I know that's not possible..." and the guy is off playing golf instead being there at work. I know it's a commercial and it's supposed to be a slight parody of Succession but it runs counterpoint to the being there for your people message.
|
|